Before I forget again -

[kyburg]

While in the car the other day, going to Heartsent we were listening to Randi Rhodes had Melissa Etheridge on her show, being girls together...and they were talking about Melissa actually breathing the same room air as Rick Warren and liking it.

This was kinda big, LGBT-community speaking and she was taking some heat over it.

I mean, how COULD she. *foot stompy*

(I don't play sandbox games like that. You know that, right?)

Well, I found her actual statement on the matter this morning, responding to something over on christianleft -

I told my manager to reach out to Pastor Warren and say "In the spirit of unity I would like to talk to him." They gave him my phone number. On the day of the conference I received a call from Pastor Rick, and before I could say anything, he told me what a fan he was. He had most of my albums from the very first one. What? This didn't sound like a gay hater, much less a preacher. He explained in very thoughtful words that as a Christian he believed in equal rights for everyone. He believed every loving relationship should have equal protection. He struggled with proposition 8 because he didn't want to see marriage redefined as anything other than between a man and a woman. He said he regretted his choice of words in his video message to his congregation about proposition 8 when he mentioned pedophiles and those who commit incest. He said that in no way, is that how he thought about gays. He invited me to his church, I invited him to my home to meet my wife and kids. He told me of his wife's struggle with breast cancer just a year before mine.

When we met later that night, he entered the room with open arms and an open heart. We agreed to build bridges to the future.

I like the choice of words - succinct, and spare. "He explained in very thoughtful words..."

I suspect the call was more than fifteen minutes. And it also underlines just how more aggressive (which turned into effective as all giddy hell) the pro-Prop 8 people were, and really how low they were willing to sink to get their way. They even used their own, no holds barred. (I think the anti-Prop 8 people thought that was far more obvious to the naked eye and believed everyone would find it a turn-off. Sorry, thanks for playing.)

Are you really about peace or not?

The Christian part of me squees over stuff like this. Just thought it was post-worthy.

Comments

[reannon.livejournal.com]

I really like this. Ever since Obama was elected, I think to a large degree we've all been like abuse victims suddenly free again, but nervous, PTSDing and ready to bolt at the slightest hint of what we've been subjected to for eight years. This Warren thing just seemed like such a huge overreaction when clearly Obama's trying to keep everyone talking, not just the people who agree with him.

I want to see Gene Robinson and Rick Warren chatting at the inaugural. That's a moment that needs to happen. That's where good things start.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

You the reporter chick - you see it come across the wire services, let us know.

[moropus.livejournal.com]

That really doesn't support my views of Warren and his buddies. Of course I was influenced by his video message. I would like to see him explain this view he offered Melissa into another video that could be found all over the internet. I'd hate to think he was just using her, or being political and making nice with her for future use.

Ye ghods, the last few years of politics have left me jaded and cynical.

I want to be a good Christian and believe the best of this man, but I'm scared to get hurt by the religious right again. I am an escapee from them.

Maybe today, I'll just believe for a couple minutes. Maybe that's enough of a start.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Here's your mantra. Repeat as necessary:

TOLERANCE.
OPPORTUNITY.
CHANGE.

[tomlemos.livejournal.com]

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and everyone is entitled to the benefit of the doubt.

The one thing that I've learned from people who are homophobic is that most folks get their ideas on homosexuals from the media or what they seem to "know" about gay people.

I always do my best to educate in a sensible manner, much like the example above.

I'd like to believe there's good in everyone, you just need to know how to access it.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

I'm reminded that every human sexuality class I ever knew of, had at least one night where a 'homosexual' was asked to speak to the class, as part of the syllabus.

And just about always, it was the first, last and only exposure most of the students had to the idea.

It's one thing when you basically swim in the notion (*raises hand*) - it's another when folks basically knew to keep their mouths shut around you. Because if you don't know someone YOURSELF - you don't know. Period. Full stop.

[the-paulr.livejournal.com]

I lived in San Francisco for 12 years. I knew many gays. Some I liked, some I didn't. But I could say the same thing about straight people. There are some I like and there are some I don't.

For me it has nothing to do with their sexuality. It's entirely about who they are as a person. A jerk is a jerk no matter who they sleep with.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

But to believe what someone else tells you - just because it's something you can't verify first hand - seems to be more prevalent in this example than any other I can recall.

Maybe you'd find it odd - or just business as usual - but I continue to find it ridiculous that so many people equate homosexuality with pedophilia automatically.

UH. NO.

(And yeah. A jerk is a jerk is a jerk.)

[the-paulr.livejournal.com]

I don't know. I think we see this more against gays now because so many other cultures that have been marginazlied throughout the years have become, shall we say, mainstream.

Unfortunately I don't find it odd that many people equate homosexuality with pedophillia. I find it sad.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

It's stupid and hateful. I'll leave it at that.

[the-paulr.livejournal.com]

I agree. It is both.

[galewolf.livejournal.com]

Good on him. It is unfortunate how politics/religion (and in this case, both) can sometimes bring out the worst in people.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Well, there's been plenty of examples set by people who should be our betters...and weren't.

[caitlin.livejournal.com]

What gets to me is all of the 'Ms. Etheridge should not have talked to Rick Warren!' comments on that post.

And the "Rick Warren is using her!" comments.

As well as all of the "Obama is not doing what he promised he would in the White House!".

Umm... Inauguration Day is 7 days from now. For the moment, Barack Obama is President-elect. nothing more. For now, he has no power. None. He resigned his senate seat last month, and will be sworn in as POTUS in one week.

I am waiting and seeing.

I do not trust Rick Warren, but to villify him - as he has done to others - lowers the one who does the villifying to his level.

Actions more than words.

Hating those who hate... really only wastes energy that could be put to better use.

But this is all IMO.

C.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Some people simply need better hobbies, neh?

[caitlin.livejournal.com]

Probably.

And I've had enough of the left-leaning folks blaming the Democrats in Congress for things that happened prior to 2007.

Feinstein needs to be kicked out. But saying "Oh, but the Democrats are responsible" (for something like faulty intel leading up to Iraq) when there is a hyoooooooge epic mess to be cleaned up in the US right now... that is not helping matters at all.

Again, IMO.

[purdypiedad.livejournal.com]

I think I'm starting to like your opinions. I share them.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Doesn't hurt to be right about such things, either.

[caitlin.livejournal.com]

The thing is, to hold the Democrats responsible for events in Congress prior to 2007 is to say that GWB and the GOP did not cook the intel for the war and all the other stuff.

From what I remember, the Dems were shut out of briefings and such prior to their regaining control of Congress.

So how are they responsible for things THEY KNEW NOTHING ABOUT?!@

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

BECAUSE THEY CAN.

(And of course, look like absolute tools in the process for being so obvious about the lack of credibility or respect for such in the bargain.)

[rin-o.livejournal.com]

it's one of those situations where everyone was wrong- from the borderline extremists that felt it needed to be banned in the first place, to the people that were caught up in the whole "wrongness of gays" thing and made choces they regret, to the people that really didn't fight hard enough for their rights. and ebcause of that everyone's too busy trying to apologize and figure out who gets the blame to actually do to much to fix it.

really, it's a restriction of regligeon so it can't be enforced or maintained....not that anyone's noticed that because it would legitimise those tiny belief systems that aren't political players.

[purdypiedad.livejournal.com]

--it's a restriction of regligeon so it can't be enforced or maintained--

It's ironic how the very first amendment to our constitution as been completely ignored on this one.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Word.

[rin-o.livejournal.com]

and painful how bad my spelling was.....ugh, i have to stop posting when i'm filling out applications, i never pay enough attention.....

[purdypiedad.livejournal.com]

lol... no worries. Not knowing you from Elvis, but seeing your content was intelligent, I just figured you might be sight impaired. *g*

Besides, I am fluent in both the reading and writing of Typo.

[purdypiedad.livejournal.com]

I think its freaking awesome how Etheridge took the high road and sought him out. What an example to both communities! It's nice to see Warren backpedal like that, regardless of his motives.

I actually have a great deal of empathy for the Christian Right (being a recent deconvert after 28 years of immersion). I understand their thinking. I understand that contrary to popular belief, generally (and, of course, there are exceptions), their desire to control and condemn is not so much based on hatred as it is a desire to serve their savior, even at the expense of making the world hate them. However, where I part company is when the Christian Right begins rewriting history and pretending that they are enjoying their freedom of religion and freedom of speech based upon the rights set forth by this "historically Christian nation." This is WRONG! They enjoy the freedoms they have because we are a SECULAR nation that promotes the freedoms of ALL peoples to practice their religions. Or, at least, that was what we were supposed to be...

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Keeping people scared and stupid for thousands of years...meanwhile, missing the point entirely. Yup.

This - more than anything else - is why my first rule is not to define my faith by exclusion. I haven't been given permission to judge someone Christian...or not...ever. Not my job.

And I really can't be part of any group that does that first, primarily and so forth.

When you realize that a lot of the 'you're not one of us' is a historical response to a community's attempt at survival and not doctrine...it gets a whole lot easier to see God around you. Not just under the roof of the place they'll let you sit in, certified and sealed.

There's entries in the Bible that exhort one to know what they're talking about, when it comes to their faith. When someone takes that responsiblity away from you (telling you God speaks to THEM, not you)...that's where the trouble begins.

Etheridge refers to a quiet voice that spoke to her. Know it well.

[valarltd.livejournal.com]

You do know that today Warren put out a call for "orthodox Anglicans" to use his facilities. In other words, "if you hate the fact your denomination treats women and gays as people, come play in OUR sandbox."

http://pewforum.org/news/display.php?NewsID=17327

I'm sorry, being nice to one person--an evangelical specialty, "showing the love of Jesus one-to-one" they call it--does NOT equate to being a decent human being. Warren does not fall into the latter category.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Wouldn't it just be a pisser if they tell him HE'S not Christian enough for them?

[anahata56.livejournal.com]

Oh, lots of people have! That's the beauty of it!

For all the LGBT people who are pissed off at Melissa Etheridge for talking to Rick Warren, there are an equal number of Evangelicals who are pissed at Rick Warren for "pandering" to the gay community by speaking to Melissa Etheridge. AND they are pissed at him for agreeing to speak at Barack "Hussein, hell--he's the Anti-Christ" Obama's inauguration!!! Smoke signals on the fundie blogs is that he's a complete sell-out--worse than the flak against Obama for choosing him.

So there ya go.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

*laughs harder*

[the-paulr.livejournal.com]

I'm willing to give Rick Warren the benefit of the doubt on this one. I'm not a Christian and find his public anti-gay marriage statements abhorrent.

But he doens't focus his ministerial efforts on being anti-gay (or anti-abortion). He believes it's a sin for Christians to let so many people live in poverty. He understands the concept of being stewards of the planet means more than use it up before the Rapture.

He's not Pat Robertson. He's not James Dobson. He's not quite Jim Wallis, but I think he has more in common with Wallis than with the extreme Christian right.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

And it appears he still wants to learn. Promising, indeed.

[kimberlychapman.livejournal.com]

Aw man, error message when posting...that hadn't happened in awhile so I'd stopped copying my comments before posting, argh, need to retype...

I like Ethridge's quotation and I agree with your analysis.

I wish more people had stood up to the prop 8 thing, but it is possible that its passage will be the proverbial last straw for enough people to instigate nationwide change. There were a lot of hetero couples/families at the protest in Austin, all out to say that enough is enough, give everyone equal rights!