And another thing -

[kyburg]

Going to the dentist this week?

Means I got to read some really fiiiine Ladies Home Journal while in the waiting room.

I read this one story about the parents who teenager "just never came home." I mean, she had therapy in town, three hours away by train and so forth and so on? Yabbity yab yab?

And they went on...and on...AND ON. She just skipped school and *swoons* -

Okay.

The topper? She'd fallen into this exotic teen subculture!

Wait for it.

..

Uh, MySpace.com.

You can imagine how hard it was not to burst out laughing and toss the damn thing across the room. I mean, really.

Access to the internet and doing something pretty normal (at least, as far as I can see?), like finding people who wanted to spend time with her, experimenting (okay, not in a safe fashion, but HELLO) with identity and so on? Those are the issues - not the existence of MySpace.

I guess I can scratch one thing off the list of things I have to worry about when my kids are teens. I don't have any illusions about where they can find people to hook up with that Mummy Doesn't Know Herself. Or why they'd go looking.

And any kid who needs therapy that can't be found within a 20 - 30 min drive? That's serious stuff. You go to those therapy sessions, too. Keep them to a minimum, get the work done and get out of there. Kids in this much trouble don't get left to their own devices 100% of the time. That's not snooping - that's a clear indicator that something is broken in the relationship, and needs attention on BOTH sides.

A minor child under the age is 18 is still a child. Expect them to act like adults with training wheels and gee, don't be surprised if that's exactly what you end up with. OH, and BTW? You don't have to be into everything the kids are? But it helps if you at least know your kids and enjoy being a part of their lives.

Teenage sub-culture, my foot....

Comments

the one thing I hate...

[tomlemos.livejournal.com]

is when parents don't parent their children and expect the rest of the world to do it for them.

Sorry, you made the decision to have kids, you have to parent them.

Espcially with the internet.

I'm amazed at the number of people who are doing things online that they shouldn't and they're all under 18.

Go figure.

Re: the one thing I hate...

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

I worked for an ISP once - try twelve years of age. I'm not kidding, and I have NO illusions. 12 year olds (with 8 year old helping them) are DEADLY.

Young does NOT mean stupid. Or incapable.

Re: the one thing I hate...

[(Anonymous)]

exactly. that's the problem.

People think this of the young far too often and don't do enough parenting.

things have changed but that doesn't mean that you expect society to parent for you.

that, i can't stand.

Re: the one thing I hate...

[tomlemos.livejournal.com]

that was me above. :)

[http://users.livejournal.com/little_e_/]

But dontcha know? MySpace is evil! If it weren't for things like MySpace, teens wouldn't have sex, they wouldn't take pictures of themselves having sex, pedophiles wouldn't be trying to find teens to have sex with, and honestly, all of the teens in our country would wear floor-length dresses/suits and go to church every day.

It's all the fault of MySpace.

I do strongly disagree with the notion that a minor is automatically a child, though.

[inagawayuu.livejournal.com]

I do strongly disagree with the notion that a minor is automatically a child, though

No, a minor is still a child. Some minors may be more mentally capable and mature than others, but they are still children.

Besides, by law they are dependent children until they reach 18. No ifs, ands, or buts.

[http://users.livejournal.com/little_e_/]

The technical definition of a child is a person between infancy and puberty.

I find it absolutely absurd to the point of delusion to refer to a 17 yr old and a 7 yr old as being the same mental/physical stage of development. They're not. They're extremely different, and if you try to treat them the same, you will end up with major problems.

People don't turn 18 and suddenly *poof* not chilrden anymore.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Oh, forget the minor child classification at your peril. There is a wide variance on maturity, but when the rubber meets the road? I've met a number of twenty-somethings with less maturity (not behavior, life skills and ability to use them period) than some fifteen year olds. You have to give kids that whole period of time to get the bugs worked out - cutting it short is cruel and unfair.

Oh, and you can adopt any child below the age of 18 - a month or day shy of it? Just the same - as a newborn infant. The law doesn't see any difference.

Every age has its own benchmarks and expectations - but a sixteen year old who doesn't communicate, is openly hostile, steals, lies and doesn't complete homework? Is a kid in trouble. Frankly, I'd be less worried about a kid who completely goth'ed himself out - and proudly showed me the results. (You think I'd find it cool? Of course! Look at the effort put forth - )

But kid who has to go to MySpace.com for attention - there's something wrong in that family, and I don't mean the presence of MySpace.

[http://users.livejournal.com/little_e_/]

I have this theory, that the more we treat people like children, the more they act like children. (Not refering to actual 5 yr olds, of course.) A teenager who is required to act like a mature, itelligent adult will (after a few mess-ups) begin to act like an adult. Even a cursory glance at the human population reveals plenty of teens who hold down jobs, support their families, save children from burning buildings, etc.

So the net result is that I think a lot of the problems teenagers have these days stem from not having enough opportunities/requirements to become adults, and instead being forced into what I see as an unnatural extended childhood. And one of the chief symptoms of that is language--calling people who would, in almost any society in the world throughout history, have been considered a full adult, a 'child'.

Most teens don't become 'troubled kids' all on their own. It's a reaction to their environment and the way they're raised. Getting more parental involvement in this particular kid's life, from what you've described of the article, wouldn't necessarily be a good thing--they ran away, at least in part, because they didn't want to live with their parents anymore. That suggests to me that the parents were the problem, not the teen.

But, of course, I'm a bit biased on this subject.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

I think the key to this is the insertion of "age-appropriate expectations."

Which, for some people? Is something so foreign, they can't get their heads around. And of course, in my book, the worst thing a parent can do is come into this business with the idea that Junior is "going to be a chip off the old block." Chuck that, Farley.

Kids will be who they are - in spite of and in some cases, despite of - the kind of parenting they receive. Knowing what the situations need...sometimes it's obvious, sometimes it isn't.

I don't expect teens to be adults - there are things I definitely expect them to be capable of, but I can't expect the same kind of focus and reasoning I would from someone older. Teens, by definition, are egocentric - VERY self-absorbed - and are in the process of putting on the last coat of cerebral connectivity that differentiates them from "cut-and-dried thinking" kids. They test out everything - they're uncertain about everything at the same time. They're also willing to consider a lot of new things - to a point. Too weird, and you lose them.

Oh very yes - the parents were definitely at the bottom of things - but it takes two to tango, as they say.

And being realistic about what you can expect? Crucial.

[kiyone.livejournal.com]

Hee hee. We get Ladies Home Journal for free! Along with "Better Homes and Gardens". Actually, it's been a while since we've gotten an issue, maybe my Dad actually stopped them from sending that crap anymore.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

You have to pay attention to this crap - LHJ is one of the "seven sisters" of magazine advertising dollars. Yup, what they say? Straight to the ears of American women, coast to coast. HUGE amounts of money goes into the publication of that crap -

The cluelessness just hit me in some very ticklish places. I mean, really!