My moment of "Oh Well"

[kyburg]

This had been in the works for months. Niece's boy had a birthday - his 12th - in February, and made the honor roll.

One of the things we'd noted when we'd had him that weekend, was that he didn't have a watch.

So. This past weekend, we decided to take him out and get him one. A nice one. One that didn't come from Burger King and kept decent time. And we'd let him pick it out.

He ended up with a $200 Fossil. (Didn't pay that much, but we did pay around $100 for it - I let Jim and the boy do the work. I looked elsewhere while they were deciding.)

I suspected he'd lose it at some point. I'm finding DS debris all over my car, my house and so on - and I had the kid less than 24 hours.

Got a call last night looking for homework. No, no homework.

And he'd already lost the watch.

..

Cost of gas to go get the kid - somewhere on the order of $60 - a tank each way.
Food, entertainment and so forth? Oh, another $100 or so.
Watch - $100
Eating at McDonalds for two days - *burp*

Losing my entire weekend to this project - priceless.

The kid offered to pay us back - I told him he couldn't. He needed to learn how to take care of his things - that was the only thing I wanted.

Right now, I'm a little dissapointed. What, I'm going to waste more time and energy on this getting angry? Please. No.

So much for handing him something he'd want to take better care of - *sigh*

You don't take care of the small things, you won't take care of the big things.

Something is up out there - not in the right place to do much other than observe and note that there are Issues afoot, but still.

The kid's a total featherhead. And on the honor roll?

Comments

[machineplay.livejournal.com]

sounds like a case of anxiety to me. featherheaded kids, like i was, are often highly anxious. :( wonder if there's anything to that theory.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

*nodsnods* Talked to Mom this morning - we're in agreement. Something is Up.

And he is related to me - think I wouldn't know anxiety when I saw it?

I'd been in therapy for three years by his age.

[kynn.livejournal.com]

You don't take care of the small things, you won't take care of the big things. [...] The kid's a total featherhead. And on the honor roll?

I go with the theory that there is probably more than this to just "irresponsible kid who doesn't take care of stuff" (which is one of the things I was labeled with).

Anxiety, ADHD, even something like Asperger's could be at play. (Not giving any diagnoses, just mentioning stuff.)

--K

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Yeah. *nods* Something is up - he IS related to me, after all. Poor kid.

The problem is now, I'm an obligatory reporter for child abuse/neglect (that foster parent thang) - something is definitely UP.

But what do I do with that?

[kynn.livejournal.com]

I don't know. I (deliberately) know almost nothing about kids.

[lackofgravitas.livejournal.com]

That was SO me at that age. If I remembered to do my homework, didn't lose my book, remembered to take it to school and hand it in, it was really good, As all the way. But one of the other things happened a LOT. Even now I constantly lose things - watch, keys, credit cards and MONEY. I'm always finding £5, £10 or £20 notes in odd pockets.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

I cheat. I've intentionally formed habits about where I leave keys, purses, etc - so all I have to do is go back to the same places to find what I'm looking for.

And I know when I can't remember things, that something is up on the anxiety count. And I need to go take care of it.

[kynn.livejournal.com]

If I can't find something, I freak the hell out. khyri has had to suffer through some of my overreactions when I can't find things.

I think a lot of that response was learned in childhood. I got taught it was very, very Bad to lose things, and Dire Consequences result.

Even when it's not such a big fucking deal.

I cheat like you. My places/habits, though, produce messy piles. When khyri tidies them up, I fall apart in an emotional mess.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Hm. Piles, no. I'm trying to break us both of that habit -

What I try to do is find homes for everything - make sure everything has a place, and is in it when not being used. What that does is cut down on stuff, believe me. Either it finds a home or it's purged.

I have a keyrack - and it's used liberally. I have two file cabinets, and while they aren't organized inside very well, they do have everything that should be in them.

My purse has a specific place on the floor underneath the keyrack. My purse always has my other pair of glasses, checkbook and wallet. If any of those things are removed, they get tagged with "lost children" flags in my short-term until they are put back.

"Lost Children" flags also get attached to people I'm waiting to come over - so if I'm expecting you, and you arrive late and I look a little harried...consider the source.

[lackofgravitas.livejournal.com]

I used to do that, but I've got ill-disciplined and have about eight possible places for everything, plus everything's so untidy that things creep away from their places. But I should get it under control, cos it does make me really anxious, especially the credit cards.

[stitch-vicious.livejournal.com]

I'm the same way with leaving stuff in my pockets. When I wash my jeans every week there's almost always shredded tissues or dollar bills plastered to the sides of the washer when I take my stuff out. I've "laundered" so much money, it's not funny.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

You know, I almost intentionally do NOT put things in my pockets for that reason. Funny, I just noticed -

[tacohime.livejournal.com]

If he offered to pay you back for it, that could be a sign of "wow, I feel really, really stupid about this."

It's another reason why I don't want an engagement ring: too scared of losing it like I've lost so much other jewelry that I really loved but still lost track of, like a teddy bear necklace from my mother or my high school class ring.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

I know he feels stupid about this - and that's concerning, too.

Something just doesn't feel right about this - I noted the anxiety last Thanksgiving and the last time he bunked in with us.

Talked to Mom - something's just not right here.

[joggingguy.livejournal.com]

Lots of smart people out there with no common sense. I think it's a galactic constant or something.

[http://users.livejournal.com/little_e_/]

I figure, there's only so much brain to go around. If your brain's busy doing lots of math, what's left to notice where you are, much less where your watch is?

[(Anonymous)]

You don't take care of the small things, you won't take care of the big things.


Man, is THAT the truth!!

[turandot.livejournal.com]

No, no, no. See, the problem is assuming that a child, however smart, would actually have the foresight of noticing what he or she does with their possessions. You don't buy a child under 18 a $100 anything and expect them to wear it and not to lose it and/or destroy it in the process.

The only reason I now own personal heirlooms like an 18K gold chain my aunt/godmother bought for me on the occasion of my baptism, and a ring bought on my first communion is that my mom never ever allowed me to wear these things unless she could supervise me for the duration. Even then, after I pretty much destroyed the pearls in her engagement ring the only time I got my hands on it, without permission, and another childhood ring was nearly destroyed and lost on a playground, everything went into my mom's jewelry box, and it went into hiding for a good long time. I didn't get that stuff back until I was in my early 20s.

There was no intent to destroy in either case, just the supreme carelessness of children who live in the moment. We tend to think of children, especially pre-teens, as miniature adults, but they are not. Children become so over involved with the interests that make them wonder (which makes them "smart" in the first place), that they lose track of everything. They don't have the same cares we do. In a way, they are still learning to take care of belongings, and it involves failing to do so and experiencing regret.

Sometimes it takes less than fleeting regret about losing a favorite possession to do the trick. I was pretty pissed about my mom's supreme show of mistrust at the time, but nowadays I'm pretty grateful to have my jewelry back and preserved more or less intactly. Not having access to them made me appreciate their value, sentimental and otherwise, a lot more. The first thing I did was buy a jewelry box of my own so I could store them properly. Even 3-4 years earlier I would have just worn them willy nilly and left them anywhere (I had done that with a watch or two bought on my own).

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

There is a term called "over the age of reason" - and that's usually the age of 7 or so. I was an anxious child - and I remember 12. There's a difference.

I fully expected him to lose or break that watch at some point - but as careful as he was with it? Two days? Uh uh. Then there's all the other things pointing to a real "something" handling Life - he's loading up way too fast to start dropping things like this. And he is very careful - he works at this.

I'm going to check my work with someone more experienced than myself -

[turandot.livejournal.com]

Did he lose-lose the watch, or is this a case of the misplaced-possibly lost? I used to misplace things as a kid all the time, often outright assuming that they were lost for good, and afraid about what the consequences would be (grounding, nagging, etc.). Of course, the more anxious I grew about it, the less likely I was to track down where I'd been. That is, if you do suspect anxiety, that's an additional reason not to have him deal with things he would want to take better care of: they're bound to provide an additional source of anxiety.

Have you tried to sound either him or his mother out about what else is going on in his life? You speak of "loading up way too fast" - is it possible that he has way too many things going on in his life (not necessarily anything bad, just too numerous things to juggle)?

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

His mother is already in for it with my Mom for her temper. You can see the concern....

"I put it in my pocket and now it's gone."

Yup. I tend to think he didn't let it out of his sight - until it fell out his pocket. Or something.

One of the reasons I'm trying to get more time with him is for things like this - I don't spend enough time to really know what's going on.

But I can tell you this - the anxiety levels are consistently high with this kid. He kept me up Thanksgiving night (after I'd had less than two hours sleep) afraid of Freddy Kreuger - cos' some bright penny had shown him the movies the week before.

Now? He's terrified of tornadoes. And you're heard about the weather we've had today, right?

[turandot.livejournal.com]

I'm terrified of tornadoes, and I'm way over the age of 12. Being terrified of certain things is not bad in and of itself. I mean, the foremost question to me should be what his parents are doing about that fear: 12 year old is not too old to be heavily reassured that the scary things out there don't happen as often as they think. I speak from experience. I was happy go lucky in elementary school, but I went through an overly-sensitive period in junior high. The little things most kids didn't tend to dwell on scared the crap out of me. I was forever terrified about things, especially the stuff that even adults don't want to think about: death, loss, pain. It never affected my school work, tho: school was easy, life seemed hard (even as there wasn't anything hard about my life, in hindsight: I had a roof over my head, I had food, I had clothes, I had people to make me feel safe, I had people to make me feel loved, etc.).

To give you an example, when I was 11 our (dumbass) next door neighbor decided to tell my mom about how one of the previous owners of our house had fallen off the roof and died almost on impact. I overheard it, and I became terrified of being alone in my room at night. I'd hear the wind outside my window, and imagine that it was not wind, but a ghost lamenting her fate. I was a little old to believe in ghosts, but even the limited rational bargaining skills I had didn't lessen my fear. I. Just. Was. Scared. And it was fall, and it was windy every other night. I'd stay up half the night with a mixture of fear and sadness, and I would cry, thinking about how sad it was, to die so easily. So my mom ended up having to sleep on a chair in my room, with the lights on. If it was windy, we'd just talk about the wind, about my feelings, about my fears. Some nights we'd barely get a wink. It went on for a couple of weeks. Gradually, my fear went away, possibly replaced by another fear that either didn't affect me as profoundly, or I just can't remember as vividly. But it took a while, and a lot of patience on part of my mom (because my dad just never did the reassurance thing right).

[http://users.livejournal.com/little_e_/]

Eh. I'm at MIT. Undergrad, then again for gradschool.

And I don't wear a watch because I can't keep track of them. Hell, I can barely keep track of the clothes I wear. I left my purse in the payroll office for a week and a half. I've lost three or four calculators (expensive ones) which I had to buy with my own money.

Do I care about these things? My purse has my wallet, my ID, my medical insurance card, credit cards, etc. (Not to mention sentimental value.) As an undergrad I could not function for a week without a calculator, and those things cost over a hundred $$.

If I have to get a watch, (timed tests, that sort of thing) I pay no more than 20 bucks for it. Because I know I'll lose it.

Giving something expensive to someone when you know they will lose it and expecting them to somehow magically become less prone to losing things simply because the item is expensive is unreasonable. Yes, people will try to be more careful with expensive items (especially if they're going to have to replace those expensive things themselves,) but some people simply are not good at keeping track of things. For me the only solution is to keep things physically strapped to my body, or else carry/wear the exact same things every day. So I *always* wear the exact same hat, and I almost never lose it. I wear the exact same jewelry which I never, ever take off.

Being smart and losing stuff correllate pretty well, actually. Of course, a lot of very smart folk are incompetent at many daily life tasks. But, well, we all look up to the supreme featherhead, Einstein, and feel okay about it...

Personally, just as I'd never spend that much money on a watch for myself, I'd never spend it on someone else whom I knew would lose it. Why throw good money down the drain?

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

*sighs* If only he hadn't admired so many others - he *likes* the nicer things (not like oh cool expensive, but wow, that's nice) and he was so careful with it when he was here....

He's a boy. 12. VERY athletic. It was a sure thing the watch would take a dive with him into the pool - at the very least. Get broken in half playing tackle football. That sort of thing.

But "I put in my pocket and now it's gone?"

[http://users.livejournal.com/little_e_/]

Ooo, I know that feeling... I had this bookbag back when I was, what, 11? 12? Which I swear to gods ate my homework. I'd do the homework, put it in my bag, go to school, and it'd be gone! To this day I have no idea what happened. Did I space out and only imagine it was there? Did it fall behind the washer? Did someone steal it?

I'm careful with my stuff--for as long as it's in my mind and before I see the next big shiny thing. Then it's into my pockets and off with my pants and upside down with the pants and you don't notice stuff falling out... Or that you just walked out without pants at all...


I'm not saying it isn't stress or something bad. It very well could be. You're in much more of a position to know than I am.

Just that, you know, I'm exactly that way. So I've grown a bit sensitive about it, as you might expect. (heh).

[nagasvoice.livejournal.com]

One of my household has ADHD. It looks and sounds exactly as you describe, and it varies in intensity and difficulty, but your kid there sounds like he's got it pretty bad. Anxiety and stress make it worse. Other peoples' comments about taking care of things and finding a home for things make it worse. Kindly reminding them at the time to grab some object and put it away makes them worse about paying attention to other things. They also just love t' shiny, the cooler and more expensive the more they talk about wanting it--but if you get it for them, that doesn't help either. They think it will, you think it will, it doesn't help their concentration on it. The moment it leaves their hand, shrot-term memory of the object is gone. Completely gone.
It's very clearly some form of brain damage.
I work with somebody like this as well. Same thing--and some of their children have it too. Lose keys, lose entry card, lose watches, lose purse, on and on, nothing stops it, no matter what level of humiliation and embrassment and inconvenience it causes them or others.
They can be a little more successful if they work at developing a placement habit, as you say you have done, so that each thing has a regular home.
But if they somehow get distracted and fail to put that thing back in its home, it's vanished.
It's a tremendous burden on those around these folks, always dealing with the strewn junk and the lost tools and the mislaid vital objects.
On the plus side, people like this can hyper-focus and remain in that concentration zone on one thing and work at it to amazing levels... so long as all cylinders are firing.
Throw them off, and it's a car wreck.
The interesting part is that I only see it in younger people.
I don't remember ever seeing these traits in people when I was growing up, with one exception. You would think, if it's a regular developmental issue, same as CP or limited capacity or other birth defects, as a matter of simple medical statistics, that I would.
I don't. Haven't, with one exception. My own dad probably had it to some degree, along with other problems, but I didn't see it in others at the time. But now I see it all the time, all over. It's alarmingly common, when I look around.
I mostly see it in people younger than me, at the oldest, people who are about 30-35. Which* really* makes me where it's coming from.

I don't know yet what might make it better, except reducing the anxiety level and trying tio establish habits of having things have a home, and those around him insisting that things live in that home.
It may take a bit of time to get him to relax enough just to be relatively normal around you, if his tension level is so high, and by then you might be able to see what the problems are from other evidence.

[actionjbone.livejournal.com]

For me the only solution is to keep things physically strapped to my body, or else carry/wear the exact same things every day.

Ain't that the truth.

For years, I wore shitty wristwatches because I, too, would lose them - I find wristwatches uncomfortable, so I'd always be taking off my watch and putting it down - usually I'd remember to pick it up again.

Then, I found the perfect solution: a pocketwatch. IT IS A WATCH THAT WILL NOT RUN AWAY BECAUSE IT IS CHAINED TO ME. GLEE.

Have I mentioned I'm a compulsive watch-looker? Yeah.

After successfully not losing my cheapo $25 pocketwatch after 3-4 years, I recently rewarded myself with a $350 pocketwatch (that I, of course, got for significantly less than $350).

It's sort of a hardware workaround for my software issue. ^_^

[murphymom.livejournal.com]

All of my kids are extremely bright (GATE certified, every one of them, and all before 2nd grade) - and inveterate losers of things. I could never get their fathers to understand that you don't let them use/wear the valuable stuff unless you are going to be there to supervise, because it WILL be lost. (The fact that the younger kid had a buddy whose parents were no better at keeping track just added to the problem.)
I was generally pretty good about not losing stuff - but I was anxiety-prone and devised methods of keeping track very early on - like huge purses/bookbags (in the days before everyone had a backpack) so that everything I carried could be consolidated into a single item, giving me the minimum amount to keep track of.
I'm not saying something ISN'T up, mind you - I'd just be more likely to put the watch down to being 12 (he's the rule, not the exception - I've not only raised 4 kids, I teach 12-year-olds).