You can have the body -

[kyburg]

This guy is probably the reason you are being stared at by Six Apart these days. Him, and the people his blog serviced.

This guy is Jack McClellan, and he's a pedophile. He's also living out of his car in Santa Monica right now. After "moving" here from Washington State.

Do a Google on the guy's name. You hear all about his blog being the place where everyone can find out what a real perv this guy is - you'll find plenty of reports on what a perv this guy IS - but his actual blog?

Well, it was never on LJ or MySpace.

It was a free-standing site, served by the NIC, who quite legitimately made it go away.

There's something wrong with this guy. But - there's something equally wrong with a response like this one, isn't there?

And the slop over doesn't stop there.

Be male. Be white, male and good with kids.

People can't actually say anything, mind. But boy, they sure think it.

And for that, I hate these jokers all the more. Messing with kids, as bad as it is?

They're not the only innocents they take out with their actions. Fucking entitlement meatwads.

Comments

[djdig.livejournal.com]

I don't know if I would criticize the person who was abused trying to stop pedophiles.

Maybe it's obsessive, but what is the problem with it?

(I'm truly curious.)

[lostboydv.livejournal.com]

There's a certain element of misandry about that site. (Funny, the term misandry isn't even known to my spellchecker, but misogyny is, of course.) I grant you, pedophiles ARE usually male. But this web site seems to be encouraging parents to challenge any man they see watching their kids. And I really would have liked to see the little girl in the coep.uk.gov video on that site go to the playground at the end of the video and find a positive male role model there to offset the negative one represented by the pedophile. Instead, she goes to a playground populated entirely by women and girls. It would be nice to have a caveat in there somewhere on that site that says, "By the way, not all men who are watching your kids are pedophiles or perverts; and looking does not necessarily imply fantasizing. Be watchful, but don't harass anyone just for sitting on a park bench and watching your kids play. Some people just think kids are awesome and fun to watch play. So be vigilant but not militant." That would have been nice to see.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Obsessive behavior is a real red flag, regardless of the root cause.

You want to stop the behavior, deal with the behavior. But running around, putting on a flashing lights and sirens display towards someone who 1) you never shared air with and 2) you don't have any reason, beyond your own personal issues, to pursue - UH

It's more than a bit over the top - and the slop over right now is proving to be a bit much. Everyone starts looking suspicious after this kind of treatment.

Frankly, I have much more concern with the guy's entitlement psychosis - so much in line with the person he's "protecting" us from. He's doing us a favor! He's saving us! He's -

A dick!

[lostboydv.livejournal.com]

Yeah, see, I love to sit and watch kids playing. Like at playgrounds and stuff. They're adorable, and I wanna have kids of my own. But I'm never comfortable watching them, because all the mothers look threatened by my presence. So I just walk the track around the park if I wanna watch the kids playing, and I glimpse them on each lap. Even then, I feel mothers' eyes on me like I'm a predator stalking their cubs. So I don't even do that so much anymore. Society doesn't seem to allow guys to love kids. A woman can watch kids without fear, but if a guy wants to watch kids, he's got to hope no one comes up and challenges his presence and casts aspersions of perversion upon him.

More women need to molest kids. Level the playing field so guys aren't the only ones who are threatened by menacing parents. :P

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

I have no trouble being Jim's "beard" for this one - the thing is, he rarely watches long before he's in the middle of things. He's the one genuinely good with kids; I'm fair to middling, but being female I automatically get credited for bringing my husband along "so well!"

Boy, if they only knew - or if they did, be comfortable knowing that.

The best part is the kids somehow know he's the one in the crowd - I've seen him greeted by toddlers just about everywhere we go. Just - because.

For every dumb thing our culture does to women; you turn around and find something as ugly or worse done to men. Signed off on by both genders.

The fact I have two brothers who are much the same doesn't make me any happier when I see women treat men this way.

And if they aren't pedophiles, they're gay. Wait for it. (Or they're in that charming subset of folks who think one is the same as the other. >_<)

[tomlemos.livejournal.com]

(Or they're in that charming subset of folks who think one is the same as the other. >_<)

This is the attitude that kept me from going into teaching.

One more time with feeling, people:

Not all pedophiles are gay or male.

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

Just what Santa Monica needs, another crazy homeless person. These people need to GTFO, I'm glad he got arrested.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Hope they send him home to his parents.

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

I hope they send him to therapy. Lots of it.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Well, they can put him in an office. If he doesn't think anything's wrong -

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

This guy needs help, big time. According to the article, he has other mental health issues and who knows what else. The fact that he seems to unable to restrain himself is what is alarming.

There should be more places for people that are just too unstable to function in society to be taken care of. Some of them, probably a vast majority, could be rehabilitated and introduced into society with a little help and consistent care. The rest would need life-long housing and care... it's expensive and pretty low on the list of priorities in people's minds, sadly. It's not exactly rewarding, effortless work, either.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

http://www.dmh.cahwnet.gov/Statehospitals/Patton/default.asp

When it had funding, pre-Reagan? It was so full of evil you could feel it driving past.

Now? Teh ebil walks the streets. You tell me.

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's better for legitimately crazy people to be wandering the streets, homeless, without food or shelter. Of course, in a perfect world, all psychiatric institutions wouldn't abuse their patients and would have funding for everyone who need it. There'd be a place for everyone in the system.

I think it's ultimately more sad that society tries to just forget about these people. They need help. They can't help how they are. Shit, just the people down on their luck, families that can't afford to live, etc, need more help.

I still maintain that we don't need any more criminal homeless in this city. A pedophile moving into your neighborhood isn't exactly something to throw a welcoming party over, especially if they try to help other pedophiles and have issues with self control. Unfortunately, there's nothing to do with these kinds of people except arrest them... and that doesn't help anything either. In many cases, it only makes things worse.

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

so... uh... where should the crazy homeless people go?

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

To a facility that can help them, not to the streets of an overcrowded city that already has most of its shelters full to the brim and most of its resources taxed by the other homeless crazies that were here first.

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

what facility is that?

how many of these facilities exist?

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

Not enough of these facilities exist, sad to say, which is why most of the mentally ill get arrested. Either way, the streets is not where crazy people belong, especially crazy people who can't control their urges to hurt others.

Streets of Santa Monica =/= lovely mansion for mentally ill to get wonderfully better with rainbows and unicorns and butterflies

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

so... just where are the crazy who "GTFO" supposed to go?

entitlement

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

Um, it's not entitlement to want a pedophile that's moved down here to GTFO. Most homeless people don't go around trying to film kids and make blogs dedicated to connecting pedos and kids. People like that don't need to bring there problems here like this one city is more equipped to deal with it.

I don't see you welcoming this guy in your neighborhood.

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

it's entitlement to think problems will should just go away.

and it's entitlement to not think about the fact there is no where to send these people. so guess where they end up? among people without the power, privilege, or voice to get these people out of their communities. it's not an accident that poor communities have higher crime rates.

of course i don't want this guy in my neighborhood. but that doesn't solve the problem. and that doesn't remove your obvious sense of entitlement. i'm not so blinkered to the situation to think that there's a simple solution like "make them just go away" without thinking about it and working on it.

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

It was an offhand comment about an individual, not a broad generalization against a group. Get off your soap box, you're not impressing anyone or doing anything except coming off as a prick.

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

It was an offhand comment

that's what entitlement looks like. offhanded and unthoughtful.

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

Yes, yes. Cry me an emo river about how entitled I am over an offhand comment. All the homeless pedophiles in the world need you as their grand champion. Your wit, proper grammar, and hair leerniz have convinced me *eyeroll*

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

All the homeless pedophiles in the world need you as their grand champion.

red herring.

you need to think a little more about your careless entitled position.

people like crazy homeless pedophiles are problems in society that need to be addressed. telling them to gtfo your entitled sight moves that problem around - to people with much less entitlement than you.

your entitlement is showing. carelessness and thoughtlessness.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

*knock knock*

Entitlement is not another buzz word for heartless bastard. Although a lot of heartless bastards have entitlement issues - the word has other connotations.

Use some care - entitlement usually goes hand in hand with arrogance, and anyone who cares to slap that label on another? Has to have a bit of that in reserve.

I think what everyone wants here is a solution - the problem is, to get one? We'd need a means to get people who need services, to services. Where? Doesn't matter. The current CW says people need to take care of their problems, themselves. And of course, the unwritten assumption is if you can't - go off in a corner, die and gee whiz, don't make all that racket while you do.

Sadly, this treats the pedophile's victims much the same as the pedophile with that kind of thinking. Solve anything? Not so much.

If only we had the resources to actually deal instead of push away. GTFO is a very basic response to overload - best to recognize it for what it is.

Everything that it is, of course.

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

Entitlement is not another buzz word for heartless bastard. Although a lot of heartless bastards have entitlement issues - the word has other connotations.

i'm not equating entitlement with heartleass bastard.

entitlement usually goes hand in hand with arrogance

this is true. and it is arrogant to be that thoughtless and careless about the consequences to other people - especially when given the opportunity to reflect upon it.

GTFO is a very basic response to overload - best to recognize it for what it is.

entitlement (like racism, classism, sexism, etc) exists as a systemic problem and embedded problem. it is embedded in society, meaning it is embedded in people. entitlement often finds expression clearest in overload situations - when people don't have the cognitive resources to censor their expression. that is to say, it is when one is least likely to edit one's words that the structure of how one thinks is most likely to be revealed.

not being able to recognize one's own entitlement and face it makes it difficult to make meaningful changes.

people want to think they are good - good without any mixture of bad. but people are a mixture of good and bad. denying the bad parts makes it impossible to address those parts and make them better.

I think what everyone wants here is a solution - the problem is, to get one?

not facing one's own entitlement means it's hard to see one's contribution to the current cultural milieu that make society think "people need to take care of their problems, themselves."

If only we had the resources to actually deal instead of push away.

start small. start locally. start with oneself.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

You'd like "entitlement" to cover everything, methinks. It would explain a lot.

I know a number of people who think all that's wrong with the rest of the world is that they have more money than them, and that justifies all the behavior they find offensive. "They're rich - they can do whatever they want!"

uh, noooooo.

I think a more productive approach is to simply realize that nobody is in this alone; nobody has to do one more thing for you.

It's hitting that balance between caring for self, and caring for others - when the rubber meets the road, people will care for themselves first.

It's the thinking that we should always operate as if we were in survival mode that's at fault. Because you would if you had to, you should at all times.

Entitlement is a newer term for something that has been around for a while - "those more fortunate."

Cut those ties, and you might just get somewhere.

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

You'd like "entitlement" to cover everything, methinks. It would explain a lot.

no. that's exactly the problem. it's not all or nothing. entitlement is not an isolate. you can't point to anyone thing and say it is entitlement. entitlement is the accumulation of small things that add up. nothing is purely entitlement, and most things are not free entitlement.

a construction of entitlement like you stated makes addressing entitlement impossible.

I know a number of people who think all that's wrong with the rest of the world is that they have more money than them, and that justifies all the behavior they find offensive. "They're rich - they can do whatever they want!"

uh, noooooo.

entitlement is the sense "what i want - damn the consequences." it's not about money, though people with money can express their sense of entitlement more easily than others - they can pay to make the consequences gtfo.

when the rubber meets the road, people will care for themselves first.

this is a culture bound expectation.

Entitlement is a newer term for something that has been around for a while - "those more fortunate."

not really.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

*winks* Except you're using the word for everything that's wrong here.

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

My thoughts on one person in one situation =/= thoughts on an entire group. You need to learn to not be so judgmental and how to not get worked up over something that has a.) nothing to do with you and b.) was not addressed to you personally.

Ooo, you think I'm entitled. Really, I care.

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

a.) nothing to do with you and b.) was not addressed to you personally.

i work with underprivileged people all the time. and i work on the problem of where the crazy people are supposed to go, the ethics of institutionalization, and the ethics of dealing with incurable cases. i also work on the problem of poor communities that get the criminally insane dumped on them because of exactly the gtfo attitude you expressed. careless thoughtless attitudes like yours make my work harder. so this kind of stuff has everything to do with me.

you words and actions have effects far beyond your intentions - even the small ones.

Really, I care.

that's the problem

[yasha-chan.livejournal.com]

careless thoughtless attitudes like yours make my work harder. so this kind of stuff has everything to do with me.

Actually, it's probably your holier-than-thou, pretentious attitude that makes your work harder. I don't really care what you do, it doesn't entitle you to go around being abrasive to people you don't even know. I actually live somewhere where homelessness is a large, daily issue so spare me your whine-one-one call on zomg the homeless epidemic.

I never said all crazy homeless people should GTFO, I said one crazy person, homeless by choice, should go back to whence he came, since unlike 99% of other homeless people he actually has somewhere to go. If that makes me entitled, like I said, oh boo hoo, I'm going to sit here and cry about your opinion of me.

Additionally, you misunderstand yet again. It's not the issue of homelessness that I'm apathetic towards, it's your opinion that I could care less about. Who are you? Some random snobby, condescending jackass whose opinion I have no reason to respect especially considering the way you treat people. So keep on, net soldier, with your e-vendetta, posting tl;dr rants and alienating people to your zomg!justice cause instead of actually doing something worthwhile with your time and effort.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Everyone assumes there are facilities. The truth of the matter is what you suspect - there are none, or those that exist are too insular to a particular community, overburdened or hamstrung to the task at hand.

Most of the ones that survive, are nearly always entirely voluntary. That's the people who need the services paying it forward - but take the next step. How many completely voluntary organizations remain stable?

[redqueenofevil.livejournal.com]

I thought they were dumping the homeless in downtown LA. Not that the LA officials haven't tried to stop it...

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Talk to catsonmars for more information - he's been following it more closely.

Homeless folks? Are getting pushed towards Santa Monica and the westside in increasing numbers as the gentrification efforts in Downtown continue.

South Central. Other places nobody wants. Not quite downtown - not anymore.

The dumping DOES continue, though. When your largest mental health care provider is the penal system, that ought to tell you something.

[bitpig.livejournal.com]

Shoot, Santa Monica had no shortage of crazy homeless people even when we lived in LA (1993-1998). I can't imagine what it must be like now that Downtown/MacArthur Park area is getting so gentrified.

For some reason we never had too many crazy street people in Sherman Oaks, though. We lived in the heart of the Valley (one block west of Ventura @ Van Nuys) and all I ever saw were porn stars and street kids around there. One time I was accosted by a beggar outside the Hughes Market near that intersection, but all he wanted was food, not money; I bought him five pounds of ground chuck and he left, satisfied. We walked all over that neighborhood on a daily basis and never encountered the kind of staggering morlocks that one regularly sees on the Third Street Promenade in Santa Monica.
I have no explanation.

[lostboydv.livejournal.com]

I really like when they genuinely just want food, not money handouts. i'm always happy to get them something to eat. Last week, I saw a lady with a sign asking for food, so I hnded her some of the stuff I'd just gotten at Taco Bell. Her reaction made me smile. She was like, "WOOO! Taco Bell! Yay!"

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

It's too hot, one. Two, too much money - so, too many cops to make it very comfortable to stay.

It's really sad. I've been here, and an adult, long enough to remember when that wasn't the case, pre-Reagan. (And yes, I was old enough to vote against him, even then.)

If Patton and Camarillo State Hospitals had still been open when you were here, you wouldn't have seen what you did. While institutions are not a perfect solution either (and aren't cheap), the alternative is what we have today.

Either way, neither provide a cure. Saddest part of all.

[stormdragon.livejournal.com]

The crazy cynic in my head is waiting for the discovery of mass graves and/or bodies of homeless people washing ashore somewhere along the coast. =P

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Mass, no. Onsies and twosies, all the time. You talk to the coroner's office, that's how it comes down.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

..

I really wish I didn't know that.

[stoneself.livejournal.com]

if there were a mass grave, maybe people would be shocked enough to do something.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

The newspapers run stories from time to time, naming the numbers...and sadly, very often, the story about the coroner who is trying like heck to find out who this or that John or Jane Doe is before they simply discard the little evidence they have on a unknown person.

The hard fact is unless it's personal, it doesn't register. Almost Dickensonian. It's surplus population. It's the people who just didn't make it. It's the percentage that couldn't be reached in time. And in high enough numbers, it becomes a norm. Sad doesn't begin to describe it.

[stormdragon.livejournal.com]

My problem with this whole thing is the mob mentality and mass hysteria that something like this is sure to stir up.

While pedophilia is a crime, he hasn't actually DONE anything to any of the kids (yet). You can't condemn a person on what is at this point, nothing more than a 'thought crime'.

Hell, if it's a perversion thing, lets nail all of those people who are writing Harry Potter slash too. They're thinking and writing dirty things about kids. Who knows when they'll nab a kid and live out their little fantasies?

While we're at it, what about those people who get off on rape fantasies with their SOs?

Oh! Lets not forget the bondage crowd! And what about those people who are into cutting??

See, I've got problems with child rapists too, but I try not to lose focus just because of how despicable I find a particular crime.

Right now, he's done nothing more than fantasize and watch. Would he have done something if left alone? Maybe. Maybe not. That's the problem isn't it? We have to choose:

How far are we willing to go to protect ourselves and the ones we care about?

Are we willing to start prosecuting people on their thoughts and desires, or do we wait until they actually commit a crime?

Consider for a moment, Minority Report. Pre-crime. Arrested, prosecuted and judged before you even commit the crime. But damnit, you might have, and we can't have that!

How about something closer to home. There's a lot of people out there I hate. I've expressed to people, numerous times, that I would gladly end these hated individuals. I would gleefully do so in the most brutal ways possible. Should I be arrested for those thoughts? I mean, hell, I MIGHT do it one day, so why not just get me now, right?

Having said all of that, let me clear one thing up about this story:

I don't have a problem with his arrest. He broke a restraining order and in doing so, committed an actual crime. What I have a problem with is that the RO, to the best of my knowledge, was issued on the fact that he was a self-proclaimed pedo. Nothing more. That's like me having an RO issued against me because I said I wanted to kick someone's ass, but never did anything more to the person than to glare at them and be downright unfriendly.

He's being attacked for a thought (repulsive as it may be), and that's all kinds of bad. When we're told what we're allowed to think, and what we're not allowed to think, I'm pretty sure that we'll have bigger problems than just some guy with a fetish posting on a blog.

[kyburg.livejournal.com]

Yup. Exactly my point. And while these guys enjoy their social klatsch over the guy they DO know - the guys they don't know about? Nothing gets done.

Sheesh. Some people need more productive hobbies.

[redqueenofevil.livejournal.com]

Hmmm... this is all very strange.

What people don't realize (ones running that website), is that most children are abused NOT by complete strangers, like this guy, but people they know.

Every person I've known who has been abused (self included), was abused by people they knew. Friends, teachers, family. Not random strangers. That's more the exception than the rule. And I hail from the abuse capital of the nation.

Likewise, people I know who were convicted of child abuse/pedophilia, etc. ALL knew the victims personally. Teachers, coaches, friends/relatives. One of my favorite teachers turned out to be a pedo years down the road. That teacher was a "SHE," by the way. I was crushed when I heard she'd done that. She's probably out of prison now, I don't know.

Another HUGE misconception is that all pedos are men. I was molested as a child by both a man, and a woman. I learned then that women can be just as malicious. And over the years, I've learned that lot of women abuse, and get caught. We just hear about the creepy man in the corner.

I wouldn't be frightened of this Jack fellow. These people have got it wrong. Maybe they're watching too much "To Catch a Predator."

[stormdragon.livejournal.com]

Bingo!